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Please let me critique characters!!! [CLOSED - SORRY!]

@CinnamonRoll forum 586 comments schedule
@Oakiin

Aaaahhhhh as usual you have the best words of advice, thank-you so much!!

(okay, so, bear with me here. I'm going to back myself into a corner and we're going to just let it happen, okay? okay.)

A lot of the small flaws and prejudices built into Boa's character seem incongruous with his massive levels of empathy. Temperamental - understandable, but he holds himself back because he's afraid to hurt others? I would expect him to hold back because his processing power mixes with empathy and soothes the anger as he starts to consider their side of the story. Having a temper to begin with is a little strange to consider, but since that's more of a basic emotional thing, I totally get it.

Ahhh, yes, you have me there! xD That's what i get for slapping together a character in a day I suppose xD I'll admit, that part was based off me a little as a child, but yeah, doesn't fit with him very well. I am NOT very empathetic at all, so there you go ^^

And then his prejudice! Boa is the kind of highly empathetic person to recognize and work through his prejudices. Much like with anger/temper, I understand a more basic, ingrained prejudice. However, given Boa's massive empathy, I don't understand how he could dislike a person without hearing their side of the story. It's the same issue with black-and-white morality: why wouldn't he hear their side of the story.

I do need to explain this one more, I feel. I got a little lazy putting it down ^^ With those two traits of his, it comes down more to do with he's never met a miner, or anyone who would agree with them, so he never hears their side of the story. In his limited social interactions, he's grown to take their words for everything, and since the nobility he's known have never been anything but virtuous and kind, it's never crossed his mind that they have the option NOT to be. If he ever talked to someone who lived in the mining community, he'd change tunes in a heartbeat, no doubt, and with some real world experience, he'll learn that just because he knows good people, doesn't mean they're all good. I hope that clears it up! (And makes sense xD) These two really have to do with him just (almost unintentionally) growing up in a very small, near gated community, who all share the same opinions.

Next issue: you can't have a perfect character. And you didn't, until I critiqued almost all of his flaws. Welcome to the corner! Given that we know you can't have a flawless angel character, I would advise you to take the above critiques with a grain of salt. You don't have to scrap these traits (if you're feeling it, you could rework his flaws completely, but you don't have to) but you should balance his personality. Boa needs an end point for his empathy, some kind of line that he draws. Once he has limits in everyday life, it'll make more and more sense that he can foster a prejudice or hold black-and-white values.

Thanks very, very much, this gave me a lot of ideas on how to improve him! Having an end-point on his empathy is a great idea, I never would have thought of it <3

History!!!!

(for starts: go OFF. obliterate the cruel system and how it forces you to choose between family and economic stability. we are living in a machiavellian economic hellscape)

(Haha thank-you xD Yeah, that's always been one thing I really hate TwT I kinda made this culture a bit of a 'F you' to some of America's systems, ngl)

History was a JOY to read and I am not joking at all. That was awesome!!!! There was so much worldbuilding!!! Of course, it's me, so I have a couple notes:

Eeeeee thank-you!!! :D Just wait till you get to Valen's haha

First up, HOW did Boa do well in training?? This sounds like a very tough-love scenario, and this is a spoiled only child who canonically can't handle criticism. If he did well there, I'd expect him to have grown better at accepting criticism, which doesn't seem to be the case. How did he manage to flourish in his Sentinel training without losing confidence or even having the occasional breakdown?

Yeah, again, I think this was a case of me getting a little lazy, you're totally right xD Canonically, (supposedly if I can figure out how to show/integrate it), he's getting over his sensitivity, slowly and surely. While he probably did get slightly special treatment, because of who his father is, I do need to go back and add in more about how his confidence was shook'd and changed/built up via the training. Thanks for pointing it out! <3

And then… the empathy. Boa's most major trait. Where does it COME from? I tend to find that empathetic people can relate because they understand, and they've been through a similar incident. Boa's had an incredible, happy life up to this point. As kind as open as he can be, how well can he really understand what the people around him are feeling with so little experience? Not just know it, but really understand.

…Is empathy a hereditary trait? I legit have no idea. That was my idea but i could be SO wrong. I'll have to look into that more!

Okay!! That's all I have for you tonight. Boa is a really, REALLY good character!! I think you need to consider where you're going in terms of balance, but beyond that, he's great! It's always wonderful to have you by the thread, and of course, I hope that these notes are helpful to you!! :DD

Ahh, this was such a joy to read, as always :D Thank-you SO much for your time and critiques, you caught everything I never would have >w< I especially struggle balancing out characters I really love, and I know that showed through with Boa. (Hopefully less so for his dad, buuuuut…We'll see xD)

@CinnamonRoll

Hello, everyone!! Slightly early tonight and ready to round up!!

Tonight's critiques are for @Katastrophe and @Oakley-is-Oaken-Bull!

Tomorrow, I'll be critiquing @Katastrophe!

@Oakley-is-Oaken-Bull - So happy you enjoyed!!! And your responses make me so happy to read. I'm positive that balance will come! :DD

@CinnamonRoll

Starting off with @Katastrophe! Top down on Damian…

(So I can't quite recall what I've said on previous critiques - sorry if any of this feels redundant!)

The overwhelming sense I get with Nature is that I don't KNOW Damian. So much of his core personality is built around friendliness and extroverted-ness - he makes friends easily! But I don't see much about how he BEHAVES with those friends. Is his flirty, overly friendly nature just a public thing that relaxes around people he's comfortable with? Does it persist, proving that he is unafraid to show his true self? And other sides, too - how does he behave while alone? Does he hate the feeling of having no one around him? How does he deal with authority, and what has that meant for him? Those various sides are what's missing in Damian's personality.

Other than that, one small thing - prejudices! I am TOTALLY fine with how he works against prejudice, and I'm proud of him!!!! But make sure to specify which bias he has to actively work against. That's still important to consider.

(angelica is my favorite name!!)

Couple of small notes on history!! First up: why doesn't he give 100% to studying? Most of Damian's motivations are wrapped around making people proud of him or living up to memories, so why is he willing to slack off in this one specific area? Second: why isn't Benjamin's death playing more across his personality? This is an event that occurred only three years ago, in front of Damian. Is he still struggling with grief? Why isn't he motivated by revenge? Is he trying to live up to Benjamin by becoming him? Stuff like that!! This is a RAW area, and I feel it needs to have more impact.

Last quick thing - Raiz. I'm reading that Damian and Raiz don't get along due to Raiz's impulsive nature, but that's reflected in the dark side of Damian's nature as well. The two of them certainly share some level of communion - why isn't that enough for Damian?

Okay!! That's all I have for you tonight. Damian is a wonderfully lovable character who just needs a few more facets to be amazing. I will see you tomorrow for the second critique!! And for now, I hope that these notes are helpful to you!! :DD

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@Katastrophic group

Starting off with @Katastrophe! Top down on Damian…

(So I can't quite recall what I've said on previous critiques - sorry if any of this feels redundant!)

The overwhelming sense I get with Nature is that I don't KNOW Damian. So much of his core personality is built around friendliness and extroverted-ness - he makes friends easily! But I don't see much about how he BEHAVES with those friends. Is his flirty, overly friendly nature just a public thing that relaxes around people he's comfortable with? Does it persist, proving that he is unafraid to show his true self? And other sides, too - how does he behave while alone? Does he hate the feeling of having no one around him? How does he deal with authority, and what has that meant for him? Those various sides are what's missing in Damian's personality.

Other than that, one small thing - prejudices! I am TOTALLY fine with how he works against prejudice, and I'm proud of him!!!! But make sure to specify which bias he has to actively work against. That's still important to consider.

(angelica is my favorite name!!)

Couple of small notes on history!! First up: why doesn't he give 100% to studying? Most of Damian's motivations are wrapped around making people proud of him or living up to memories, so why is he willing to slack off in this one specific area? Second: why isn't Benjamin's death playing more across his personality? This is an event that occurred only three years ago, in front of Damian. Is he still struggling with grief? Why isn't he motivated by revenge? Is he trying to live up to Benjamin by becoming him? Stuff like that!! This is a RAW area, and I feel it needs to have more impact.

Last quick thing - Raiz. I'm reading that Damian and Raiz don't get along due to Raiz's impulsive nature, but that's reflected in the dark side of Damian's nature as well. The two of them certainly share some level of communion - why isn't that enough for Damian?

Okay!! That's all I have for you tonight. Damian is a wonderfully lovable character who just needs a few more facets to be amazing. I will see you tomorrow for the second critique!! And for now, I hope that these notes are helpful to you!! :DD

Absolutely helpful! I felt like something was missing when redoing him. His history is the newest of all the characters and I kinda struggled with why he would be part of the story. A big event that would motivate him in so many ways was the perfect puzzle piece, but I guess I forgot to go back and adjust his personality. As for Raiz, they are more similar than they seem on the surface level for sure. I hope Raiz's page clarifies this better on why they don't exactly get along, but I found their relationship more difficult to describe than I expected. Lots of great points I will definitely use to polish Damian, thank you!

@CinnamonRoll

All right, @Oakley-is-Oaken-Bull, here we go!! Top down on Valen…

sorry what do you mean eventual antagonist what uhh my good sir -

(not even ready to offer critiques, just popping in to say that I NEED TO MEET ARVEN AND SASHA RIGHT NOW)

Jesus Christ, this man is SO well-developed. I WILL be nit-picking here, but just know that you did an amazing job with him!!

Okay, first little thing: disagreements. So Valen is a person who hates disagreement, and will do his best to smooth things over. But he also struggles to delegate at times, tends to self-sacrifice in battle, and questions the king. A lot of his personality will naturally lead to disagreement! So the question is this: does Valen have the same response to arguments when people are arguing with HIM? If he does, then a portion of his self-assuredness will probably leave him. If he doesn't, he's being hypocritical and acting kind of entitled. Which is a very real personality issue that would be neat to explore if you were feeling it. But either way, make sure to spell out the consequences of his occasionally inflammatory actions.

Also, I'd like to see more about how Valen acts when he's alone. It seems like he depends a lot on connection and interaction, but there must have been a point where he was totally alone, either for a mission or just because his wife and son were out of the house. How did that affect him? Is it more of a boredom thing, or more of a trauma-comes-rushing-in thing?

(Interesting thing here - if Valen is a tough-love kind of guy, I feel like Boa would be JUST fine with criticism. I mean, it's what he grew up with).

"But I shan't, out of respect for your time" HOW DARE YOU. my time is worth NOTHING if I can't immerse myself in your glorious lore dumps my GOD

sweet and holy mother of god the king's gonna go dark

king novik: wingman of the year

BOA IS GOING TO DIE

the MURDER of the KING sorry WHAT now

I'm going to lose my damn mind you need a book or a netflix series or several highly successful films RIGHT now

I forgot to look for critiques while reading that. let me go back for a sec here -

Backstory in and of itself is SOLID, SOLID, SOLID. Like, it's amazing. And it's fun to read! But there are a couple events that I feel don't translate enough into his personality, and they mainly have to do with his leadership strategy. First up is his relationship with his sister. Valen and his sister were best friends, but it seems like she was the more dominant personality, and Valen was more of a second fiddle around the most important person in his life. And that's great! But after that, how did he become a dominant personality in his own right - a strong and capable leader? Events between the death of his sister and his appointment just below the king include almost dying and meeting the love of his life. Both major, but neither likely to foster a growth of leadership qualities. I'm not saying he never had them, but I would encourage you to set the scene for how/when they emerged!

And then there's his capture in Hell. Obviously NOT the ideal place to be, and his self-sacrifice ensured that he suffered the most. What impact did that experience have on his leadership? Did he grow more cautious? Less decisive? More defensive? Such a huge experience would probably impact the choices he makes moving forward.

WOOOOO, okay!! That's all I have for you tonight!!! I know a fair amount of it is just me getting excited about your story, but I think a little validation spiced in is okay!! Valen is an AMAZING character, and I'm WAY too invested in him already. I hope that my notes are helpful with the tiny little bumps in his character!! :DD

@CinnamonRoll

@Katastrophe - hey, quick response!!! So glad it was helpful!! And I agree - adding that motivating event will add amazing nuance to Damian's character! I'll see you again tomorrow for Raiz! :D

@CinnamonRoll

Hi, folks!! Short enough round-up for the evening:

Tonight I'll be critiquing @Katastrophe !!

@CinnamonRoll

All right, @Katastrophe, back again!! Top down on Raiz…

The biggest issue I have with Raiz's personality is that he feels a little one-dimensional. While it's okay to have genuinely mean or arrogant characters, remember that those traits need as much of a basis in backstory/deeper personality as anything else. Right now they seem to just be… there.

I'd also really encourage you to examine a softer side. It doesn't have to be all squishy, but maybe just… he feels strangely bad about insulting certain people, or he tries to smile at a couple friends now and again. Little tiny things to remind us that this is still a person (um… I think?) will do SO MUCH for his character.

Oh!!! History tells me a little more about him: He's insecure about his seize in particular. That's really great, and I would love to see more of it in personality! If his confidence is based in false bravado, how does he act when he receives an insult? Has he ever opened up to someone about his insecurity? If not, how has that affected him?

(history story-wise is perfectly fine!! and I like the inclusion of a small encounter that sent him spiraling!!)

One thing in notes raises questions. One, protective nature. If Raiz is so protective of his friends, and Damian is a protective personality, why aren't they compatible? I read that Raiz was disappointed to find out Damian was protective rather than aggressive, but that's what he's like, too.

Okay!! That's all I can offer you tonight. Raiz definitely has more to him than meets the eye, but I would love to see more of his softer side and protective nature! I love meeting your characters, and I hope that these notes help you!!! :DD

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@Katastrophic group

All right, @Katastrophe, back again!! Top down on Raiz…

The biggest issue I have with Raiz's personality is that he feels a little one-dimensional. While it's okay to have genuinely mean or arrogant characters, remember that those traits need as much of a basis in backstory/deeper personality as anything else. Right now they seem to just be… there.

I'd also really encourage you to examine a softer side. It doesn't have to be all squishy, but maybe just… he feels strangely bad about insulting certain people, or he tries to smile at a couple friends now and again. Little tiny things to remind us that this is still a person (um… I think?) will do SO MUCH for his character.

ooo yes! I have some softer scenes planned for him later on, but I think I can get one in a little earlier to really show off his character. Though I think him trying to smile might come across as terrifying.

Oh!!! History tells me a little more about him: He's insecure about his seize in particular. That's really great, and I would love to see more of it in personality! If his confidence is based in false bravado, how does he act when he receives an insult? Has he ever opened up to someone about his insecurity? If not, how has that affected him?

One of the "arcs" so to speak is the party fighting a full size dragon, which helps bring Raiz and his personality into perspective. It's one of my favorite scenes and I can't wait to draw it. As for talking about his insecurities, he views them as weaknesses. Maybe I can make that a sort of landmark when he and Damian do start working together? Now I have some ideas…

(history story-wise is perfectly fine!! and I like the inclusion of a small encounter that sent him spiraling!!)

One thing in notes raises questions. One, protective nature. If Raiz is so protective of his friends, and Damian is a protective personality, why aren't they compatible? I read that Raiz was disappointed to find out Damian was protective rather than aggressive, but that's what he's like, too.

I think this comes down to Raiz's confusion in power. While Damian is protective like a shield, defensive, Raiz is very offensive in a more "get rid of the threat" kinda way. Raiz sees aggression and attacking first as more powerful (and Damian's way of doing things weak). I guess it's not supposed to make too much sense because they are supposed to be alike, just severely miscommunicating and each having their own issues. Hopefully this makes more sense? This is the part where I was struggling to describe their relationship.

Okay!! That's all I can offer you tonight. Raiz definitely has more to him than meets the eye, but I would love to see more of his softer side and protective nature! I love meeting your characters, and I hope that these notes help you!!! :DD

As always, I love and very much appreciate your insights! Thank you!

@CinnamonRoll

Hi, guys!! All quiet on the thread tonight!

@Katastrophe - I'm happy to hear you're still enjoying!! Opening up about weaknesses would be SUCH an amazing character moment, and the connection could help with miscommunications (which I LOVE as an explanation, by the way)!!

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@tiredandconfused group

Hi! I'm back again Astezas Consort Elionnel Maveryn

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@LilMeme group

Asumi Himawari. Well here's my new and improved Asumi

Note: For context, the blue hair during ding-dong ditch and the star gazing bit was actually Kage

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@Katastrophic group

I hate to take up so many slots, but I this is my last pair and I wanted to get them in before your end date q-q
The last few are really spoilery and plot heavy with their personalities, so they outright won't make much sense. With that said, here's my final pair:
Rei: Rei Lindwood
Ki: Ki
Something def feels missing from Rei, I think, but I can't quite figure out what aspects are lacking.

Queen!!

Here's my main character. It's first character so please be gentle but very much honest, thank you!! :)

@CinnamonRoll

Hi, guys!!! Sorry for going dark for so long. I've been getting REAL busy, and I've decided to close this thread early. Everyone who's dropped links still gets a spot. I've made time to critique tomorrow and the day after, so that's when I'll take care of these!! Tonight I'm just on to round up during a quick break.

So tomorrow, I'll critique @tiredandconfused and @LilMeme!!!

Day after that, critiques are for @Katastrope (both characters) and @Queen!!

So so so sorry you guys. I'll try and give a proper goodbye in a couple days! :D

@Oakiin

All right, @Oakley-is-Oaken-Bull, here we go!! Top down on Valen…

sorry what do you mean eventual antagonist what uhh my good sir -

Haha yeahhhh, I hate his arc with all my heart : D

(not even ready to offer critiques, just popping in to say that I NEED TO MEET ARVEN AND SASHA RIGHT NOW)

(If/when you open up again I'll send these two to ya! xD I love them so much, they're the best <3)

Jesus Christ, this man is SO well-developed. I WILL be nit-picking here, but just know that you did an amazing job with him!!

YAY! I was so worried I'd made a terrible, imbalanced character ^^

Okay, first little thing: disagreements. So Valen is a person who hates disagreement, and will do his best to smooth things over. But he also struggles to delegate at times, tends to self-sacrifice in battle, and questions the king. A lot of his personality will naturally lead to disagreement! So the question is this: does Valen have the same response to arguments when people are arguing with HIM? If he does, then a portion of his self-assuredness will probably leave him. If he doesn't, he's being hypocritical and acting kind of entitled. Which is a very real personality issue that would be neat to explore if you were feeling it. But either way, make sure to spell out the consequences of his occasionally inflammatory actions.

tbh he might be leaning a little more towards the hypocrite/entitled side, he's got a…couple pride issues. Honestly, I'd kinda like to go into that and make it more of his character now, I'm kinda into that idea ^^ Thanks for pointing this out, you may have just inspired a whole new facet of his personality xD

Also, I'd like to see more about how Valen acts when he's alone. It seems like he depends a lot on connection and interaction, but there must have been a point where he was totally alone, either for a mission or just because his wife and son were out of the house. How did that affect him? Is it more of a boredom thing, or more of a trauma-comes-rushing-in thing?

Hmmm, good point! I'll definitely go deeper into this. I can tell you right off the top of my head that he's kinda both. It's not really traumatizing to him, just,,, really uncomfortable. That's when he goes out of his way to find company. If he really can't, he talks to himself, like a LOT. probably as much as I do haha

(Interesting thing here - if Valen is a tough-love kind of guy, I feel like Boa would be JUST fine with criticism. I mean, it's what he grew up with).

(Yeah, actually, Valen is a really good dad, but…he's literally the reason Boa's so sheltered and spoiled insecure about being yelled at, he was waaay too overprotective of Boa. It's his first child, and he, being just star-struck, loves Boa a little too much, if that's a thing. His wife wasn't really happy about this, and it was one of the few reasons they ever argued. Also part of why Valen did certain things after Boa's death)

"But I shan't, out of respect for your time" HOW DARE YOU. my time is worth NOTHING if I can't immerse myself in your glorious lore dumps my GOD

I'm sorry, I'm sorry!! xD xD I'll make sure to go waaay too into it with Ranir, if you're open again ^^ (Are you planning on opening these next summer? Or just playing by ear? or just not?)

sweet and holy mother of god the king's gonna go dark

really tho

king novik: wingman of the year

REALLY THO

BOA IS GOING TO DIE

the MURDER of the KING sorry WHAT now

:D :D :D Yep! And it's going to be great! I can't wait to put my players through all that!

I'm going to lose my damn mind you need a book or a netflix series or several highly successful films RIGHT now

Ahhh I wish TwT i just hope my family likes the game tbh xD Also, I wish all of it were mine, it's a little bit of a fan game as well. Valen's technically not even my character, but they NEGLECTED him horribly in the game, he only got like, six seconds of screen time and a backstory that literally only said "His son died and he betrayed everybody, ok that's all" They didn't name Boa, or name any wife, or go into him beyond this. He's too much of a sweetheart to NOT be developed more, it's just a crime to let him be so underrated.

I forgot to look for critiques while reading that. let me go back for a sec here -

Haha ain't that a mood xD

Backstory in and of itself is SOLID, SOLID, SOLID. Like, it's amazing. And it's fun to read! But there are a couple events that I feel don't translate enough into his personality, and they mainly have to do with his leadership strategy. First up is his relationship with his sister. Valen and his sister were best friends, but it seems like she was the more dominant personality, and Valen was more of a second fiddle around the most important person in his life. And that's great! But after that, how did he become a dominant personality in his own right - a strong and capable leader? Events between the death of his sister and his appointment just below the king include almost dying and meeting the love of his life. Both major, but neither likely to foster a growth of leadership qualities. I'm not saying he never had them, but I would encourage you to set the scene for how/when they emerged!

Thank-you, thank-you, thank-you!!! And thank-you again for nit-picking and throwing out those inconsistencies and issues! :D
I really need to stop being shy about going into too much detail with these, I actually know all that about his development even with Ralli there, she's a little more loud than him, but they've always worked together as a smooth team of leaders. But his real prowess and ability didn't really start to shine until after they were placed on different teams late in the sentinel camps. Then he started leading in his own right, and grew a lot more assertive through the Night Parade, and ultimately, the Commander Trials.
I'll have to go more into that in his bio :) Thanks for pointing it out!

And then there's his capture in Hell. Obviously NOT the ideal place to be, and his self-sacrifice ensured that he suffered the most. What impact did that experience have on his leadership? Did he grow more cautious? Less decisive? More defensive? Such a huge experience would probably impact the choices he makes moving forward.

Haha, yeah, I…got lazy with that one. I pretty much sat down and wrote his whole backstory in one day, and man I gotta quit doing that xD There's actually probably another three or four paragraphs about that venture, but what I will say happened in a nutshell, is he got WAY more protective of his people, even more so, that is, and he had a very hard recovery, with a lot of trauma response and night terrors. He never made the mistake that got them caught again, and he's a lot more likely to think through his split-second decisions while he's acting on them, in case he needs to abort. Rather than just make the decision, and go with it.

WOOOOO, okay!! That's all I have for you tonight!!! I know a fair amount of it is just me getting excited about your story, but I think a little validation spiced in is okay!! Valen is an AMAZING character, and I'm WAY too invested in him already. I hope that my notes are helpful with the tiny little bumps in his character!! :DD

thank-you SO much, this was a joy to read! :D

THANK-YOU SO MUCH!!!! Not just for this, but for all the critiques you've given me and my babies, you've really inspired me a lot and given me a lot of confidence :) I really appreciate you for starting this up, I hope you have nothing but the best school year. if you ever need or want anything, I'm happy to return favors :)
Thanks again so much!! I know I've thanked you probably a thousand times, but I mean each one <3