communism haha.

I see what you're saying, and I get the point you're making. However, irregardless of whether or not Hitler believed in Jesus and all of that, to lump the Holocaust in with the Spanish Inquisition and the Crusades feels wrong, because it was not religiously motivated. If something is not primarily religiously motivated it cannot and should not be lumped into the same category as things that are. I would even say the same for Colonization and Slavery; while neither was a good thing, neither was religiously motivated. The Bible was used, yes, in some cases, to excuse it, but they were not motivated by religion, they were motivated by trade and merchants and the desire for cheap labor

Yes, that's true, and I do understand the difference. However, much of European history was committed by Christians, simply because of how prevalent the religion was throughout Europe (And still is). And so it kind of rubs me the wrong way when it's all lumped together and pinned on Christians, because it feels like an oversimplification (my apologies I am a massive history nerd). And so yes, Christians committed like, most of the awful things that have happened in the past 500, 1000 years. Christianity has done some shitty things that can be blamed on them, for sure. Conversion therapy, the crusades, the fucking Inquisition, homophobia (literally can be blamed on Christians lmao), and just,,,, a lot of bad things like that. However, just because something was committed by a Christian is not a reason, in my mind, to hold it against the religion? Yeah, White Christians have murdered and raped and destroyed for centuries, but to boil all of the varying influences down to "Well they were Christian, so Christianity and Christians = bad" is an oversimplification and just a bad take, imho. Am I making sense? Or have I simply misunderstood what you were saying?

(also I do want to note that I'm not like,,, shitting on you or your opinions at all!! I simply like to debate and I'm doing my best to be respectful while doing so)

By WHITE Christians specifically. My point is, modern Christianity, especially in a white perspective, DOES benefit the cishet white man, BECAUSE of its history in oppression. It also can harm POC and LGBT communities in many ways, like how the last Native American Residential school was closed while my parents were alive.

definitely definitely definitely I completely agree with that point, and I don't disagree about that at all

Yes precisely, yes. Do you see why I have a problem, though, with them all being lumped into the same category? Yes they were committed by white Christians, but they don't necessarily belong in the same category?

Calm down queens I wasn’t trying to start discourse. Look, both of what you guys are saying has merit but I think it best to say… perhaps chill?

Yes, it's a category all of them can fit under, sure, but it is far from the most relevant category. Does that make sense? Just because there is correlation does not equal causation. For instance, car sales and autism diagnoses have both been rising. Is there any similarity between the two? Does one drive the other? No. Similarly, Christianity may be a common thread between each of these, but it did not necessarily drive each of these (again, except for the Crusades and Inquisition. Those were driven by white Christians lmao). Yes, they all fit within the category, but it's not quite relevant? And it is not direct correlation

Calm down queens I wasn’t trying to start discourse. Look, both of what you guys are saying has merit but I think it best to say… perhaps chill?

Skdbdhhs sorry Orion, not trying to start a fight, I just,,,,, care deeply about this and idk exactly why, I just do

No problem my dudes, just seemed to be getting a teeny bit heated was all. You’re good!

I've been eating popcorn and watching this go down
I think you both brought up good points though ^^

Lmao thanks, Reed

considering that communism is arguably the greatest threat to a peoples collective freedom, I believe that it should remain The scornful stain on humanity that it is…

equality achieved only at the point of a sword, or the stroke of a pen, is not true equality.
objectively every communist government in history has had to use violence and repression to keep everything from going to hell. Communism is the single greatest threat to the freedom of a sovereign people across history.

Sovereign people? Fuck off. Nobody in this hellhole is fucking sovereign.

Also please be civil ^^

Look, I’m just saying, pretending you’re better than someone else… eh. Also, I believe @ahollinger000, based on the facts, would be the type of person to say democratic socialism is basically communism which is a pussy move so honestly I don’t care about whatever point you’re making. Like, have any of you talked to a communist? One that can actually elaborate their ideas mind you, don’t talk to me as I am the last person to represent this bitch.

based on the facts? Where did you get your facts?

for your information, I personally believe that democratic socialism if not well implemented can become a slippery slope into something more totalitarian.
I'm a proud centrist conservative who has always believed there are good ideas all across the political spectrum.

most of the communists i've encountered over the years always seem to be naïve young people who want some kind of basically impossible utopia that throws personal freedoms to the wind in favor of high minded equality and other supposedly progressive BS

Sovereign people? Fuck off. Nobody in this hellhole is fucking sovereign.

we have an imperfect democratic republic that is better than most other systems across the world. People in this country are more free here than they would be in any other country.

for your information, I personally believe that democratic socialism if not well implemented can become a slippery slope into something more totalitarian.
I'm a proud centrist conservative who has always believed there are good ideas all across the political spectrum.

Oooooh, okay. Damn that must suck babe, thoughts and prayers.

Honestly I would make a joke about you never getting laid but I legitimately feel sorry for you. You’re so naive to how the world actually works, obviously in our lifetimes communism/socialism is only an idea. But if we strive for better for our future generations who knows what we will bring up? At least in most other countries I’m not going to get thoughtcrimed for thinking about abortion like in…. some states, at least going to gender therapy isn’t being considered as child abuse, at least I’ll just be dead and rotting. Legit wanna move to somewhere abroad just to piss you off right now, and if I had the money I would but I work at shitty Costco stocking shelves with shitty hours and shittier pay because America is a capitalist shithole that doesn’t care about its people and will only listen to money and fearmongering by hate groups.