Debate. Debate. Debate.

Killing a nine year old in cold blood and getting an abortion because of an unwanted pregnancy are VERY different things.

My rule of thumb is that if it doesn't involve you in any way you don't get an opinion. (levels a gaze at old white men)

someone can have an opinion all they want and there’s nothing you can do about it. Suppression of speech is against everything American; and I believe that if you attempt to suppress dissenting opinions then that is a very slippery slope.

but sometimes the voices of the oppressed are silenced by people who aren’t effected by the issue.

but sometimes the voices of the oppressed are silenced by people who aren’t effected by the issue.

So you're saying old white men can't be effected by abortions?

not just old white men, any men. Men will never get an abortion, unless they're trans. So yes, they can have an opinion but its not nearly as vital as the people who are more affected.

No, but they could be the fathers of the child getting aborted. Everyone's effected eventually, just some significantly more than others.

i suppose, but they aren't the ones who will have to suffer and endure months of pain and discomfort. Did you ever come across that textpost written by a man in a similar situation? His then-girlfriend had gotten pregnant, and wanted to get an abortion, but he convinced her not to.The man and his now ex-girlfriend agreed that she would give birth, and he would take the baby. The woman agreed to pay child support, but made it clear she would not be in the child's life. He thought that "once she gave birth the motherly instincts would kick in" but they did not. So he goes on the internet, and stars whining about how his life had gotten soo much worse becuase of this baby, etc etc. how is that fair to the poor kid?

So what's more fair, having a terrible father and no mother figure or being slaughtered brutally when you feel the pain most intensely and cannot speak for yourself?

neither are good, and i wouldn't use the term "slaughtered brutally" becuase that would indicate some form of malice, or wrongdoing. but that's just me i gues.s

but the only late term abortions are caused by some kind of problem- like the baby is going to die anyways, and take the mother with it. I’m sure most mothers who had to endure a late term abortion wanted a child and weren’t just frivolously getting rid of a baby they’ve carried for moths. sooooo maybe let’s not bring that into the “abortion is murder” narrative, because it can make already grieving mothers feel even worse.

So you would force a woman to carry something within her body that she does not want?

Okay, I’m going to give my extremely blunt and biased opinion here:
I think it’s more humane to force someone through unwanted labor as a consequence of their actions than to brutally, painfully murder someone else who can’t speak for themselves because of a mistake their parents made. Sure, neither of them are fair or deserved, but the first one sounds a bit less… Insane. Just my opinion though.

I feel extremely weird talking about this
I know, if the mother is considering an abortion, she probably didn’t intend to get pregnant in the first place. It was all an accident, and she shouldn’t be fully blamed. But there are so many ways to prevent this situation that don’t include killing the child, so who’s fault is it, the mother for not being cautious enough or the baby for existing?
Maybe the mother did try to prevent it and it didn’t work out for whatever reason. It still isn’t the baby’s fault, so why should they be killed for it? If you’re going to do the thing that’s known for creating babies, you have to accept the fact that there is, indeed, a chance you’ll end up with babies, so if you’re not ready for them, don’t risk it.

Many people are informed of the dangers of pregnancy, but much fewer know about the dangers and risks of abortion.

How about in cases where the mother didn’t consent at all? It’s not her fault in the slightest, but it’s not the child’s either. So why should this baby have to receive the death penalty for something they didn’t cause?

(I had to type all this pretty fast due to my WiFi, I apologize for any spelling errors, logical issues, unfinished points, or broken links)

Women are not incubators.

Hold up, now I’m confused, aren’t incubators those things that protect unusually small or premature babies so they can continue to grow and regain health? And isn’t that kinda what the womb is built to do in the first place? …Making women, in a way, natural incubators but for their own children if they have any? I’m confuzzled, educate me. (Sorry If something’s offensively wrong here, I truly don’t mean to be sexist or anything along those lines, I’m just a bit ignorant and want to understand these things better. _{Tbh it’s kind of embarrassing that I’ve messed up so many times I have to include apologies when I argue or ask questions in debates} )

Okay but, at seven or eight months, that mother does not want to get an abortion. She’s probably already brought clothes, maybe even made a room up for them. She’s picked out a name. And then, a doctor tells her that if she carries this baby to term, she and the baby might both die. Her only option is to get an abortion, or She and the baby die in pain. She’s devastated, but it’s the only thing she can do. Is that murder?

(okay also i just want to interject and say that i love how a lot of us have gotten better at debating and everything)

((I want to put my opinion here but I don't want to sound like a complete idiot.))

(Don't worry about it! The whole purpose is to share opinions. I doubt mine too, but it is my opinion and I know that here it's respected.)

(I only have my opinion and not a lot of facts either, and this is my first debate, but it's fun…)

As a medical student that studied obstetrics you guys are really starting to irritate me. (Sorry I just had to say it. Eris is blunt.)
Give me a moment to write up my other responses.

Okay so let me just start off by telling you guys how abortion works because you are all under the impression that its a rather brutal act of insanity. (Those of you against anyway.) Also….yes I have seen all of these procedures performed.

Medical Abortion - (AKA The Pill)
This is done only between 8-10 weeks. Which means there is no 'baby' or 'consciousness', it's literally a clump of cells that look more like cottage cheese than an actual human. The woman in question takes the first pill with her doctor and this releases the natural hormone, that women's bodies can already produce, to stop the pregnancy. There is no pain for anyone during this. There can be some bleeding and discomfort, but nothing worse than a natural menstrual cycle.
Up to 48 hours later, depending on the advice from a doctor, the woman takes another pill(s) to empty out the uterus. By this time the pregnancy is already terminated and the woman will go through her cycle naturally. Doctors will prescribe pain medication for the woman, should she need it.

As you can see…. there is ZERO slaughter and inhumane pain.

In-Clinic Abortion - (AKA The Vacuum)
This is actually the most common form of abortion technique and is completely humane despite it's horrid nickname. This procedure can be done up to 16 weeks, with doctor consultation, but usually not done past 10 weeks. The woman is given a shot of natural hormone to terminate the pregnancy, the same used as the above mentioned pill, a shot of pain relief, and a shot of sedation in which they can be awake for the procedure or asleep. Then a gentle vacuum like machine is used to suck out the pregnancy and tissue within the woman's uterus. It takes about 10-15 minutes with an hour of recovery time monitored by medical professionals.

Again….zero slaughter and inhumane pain.

Surgical Abortion
This is the one everyone freaks out about, although there is no need to. This can be performed at any time after 16 weeks gestation, but can require consent from the woman, her doctor, and a judge. Usually this is ONLY done if the pregnancy is no longer viable. Meaning- the fetus has died, the woman's life is in danger, the fetus' has extreme medical issues and will not survive etc. (I wont go into detail about how this is done because it can be a bit….graphic.) Pretty much what happens is the woman is given a shot to end the pregnancy and induce labor/ break her water. This includes antibiotics and pain relief/ sedation. The fetus and company is then removed after it is confirmed that there are zero life signs.

Lastly….zero slaughter and inhuman pain. The Fetus doesnt feel pain, because there is nothing to feel. Nothing gets heinously ripped and torn apart or out of the woman. The procedures are sad and difficult to watch for the faint of heart, but there is nothing to be afraid or angered about.

thanks!

Thank you Eris, I was going to say something about that. But I don't have all the facts.

But the child still dies, maybe it’s not as painful but that’s still completely messed up (in my opinion)